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Welcome to the Designers Plants and Coffee podcast, where we're sewing, sipping, and staying rooted.

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We're three creative women building handmade businesses and sharing real conversations about

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design growth and what it really takes to make things that matter.

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So grab your coffee, pull up a project, and let's grow together.

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Today we're going to be talking about the closure of these major craft retailers or the liquidation of Simplicity Pattern Group. Simple.

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So we just want to give our thoughts on why this is happening and maybe there's some opportunities for smaller brands.

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So why do you think they closed Naima, you can take it away.

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I think a lot of it was about money.

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If you really get into the weeds of it and look at, you know, how joann was doing before, they

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weren't struggling and they weren't failing.

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So that just makes you think that they did it for the money.

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And I also could go nerd deeper, but that's another whole episode where I was watching a video

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of a woman who kind of broke it down.

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Like, how these liquidation companies work.

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How do I feel about it?

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I feel like it's going to be a major loss for the creative community. Let's be realistic.

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Joann's had turned into more of a craft store than a fabric store anyway.

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Nobody on earth needs that much fleece.

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And if you're a fleece lover, I'm sorry, I don't mean to offend, but my goodness, can we get some silk? It's a loss.

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And at first I was like, well, you know, there's other places, but all live in the fashion capital of the United States.

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I live in a major metropolitan city, so we have other places and we have other stores.

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But when I think about these sewists and creators and designers who are in places where it's

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not as readily available, I feel like it's a disservice to them.

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So, Tish, what do you think happened?

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I definitely think the same thing.

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It was really about money.

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Plus, I mean, I think they had.

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They've gotten away from how they started.

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It really became more about crafts.

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But when it came to being a sewist and patterns and actual fabric, I would go in there and it

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may be a handful of things that I really wanted, but most times I only went to get muslin because

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they didn't have a great selection anymore of fabrics.

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Instead, it's like, okay, well, I'm just going to take the time and I'm going to order from

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someplace else, get swatches from someplace else.

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We won't say those stores because, hey, but with that, I definitely think that some of the smaller

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communities, they're really going to miss it because where are they going to go now?

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They have to buy online as you say.

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That is so funny because I have gotten back into making more clothes and making things for myself.

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As I teach more, I'm making more.

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And everybody knows I'm a fabric hoarder. It's not a secret.

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And as I'm pulling some of these textiles out, I'm like, oh my God, I remember this.

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Joann, you could find some gems in there.

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But it was a scavenger hunt in the later days.

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You had to swim through a mountain of fleas, things that nobody needed.

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You know, for apparel makers and garment makers, it was just a whole bunch of stuff that was

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a turn off because you have to practically go into the back of the store for what you need and

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you know, by the time you weed through all of it, you're over it.

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Well, I mean, I piggyback off what you guys just said.

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It's a loss to the crafting creative community, definitely.

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But what I think happened is they really didn't keep up with the times.

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There was a lot of just speaking as a pattern maker designer, they didn't offer PDF patterns,

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they just got into like the ditto projector type thing.

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So they really weren't keeping up with what the home sewing industry was doing.

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People moved elsewhere, they moved to indie pattern makers, to wherever, you know, stuff was

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cheaper because it wasn't necessarily the cheapest thing.

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It's just, I think what happened is they were stuck in their ways, got too big and they did

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not keep up with the times of what people were asking for.

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And then of course that was money, that, that cost them money and they weren't making no, they

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had to answer to their shareholders or whoever and hence is why they closed.

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That said, we heard that the Simplicity group, which is, has Vogue, Butterwick, McCall's, all

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of those pattern, the big four, they liquidated based on Joanne's closure.

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So why do you think that is and what do you, what effect do you think that's going to have on the sewing?

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I'm still stumped by that one.

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It had gotten to the point where most people were turning to the Simplicity group to buy their

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patterns because you couldn't find anything in joann's even when it was was doing well.

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You know, I'll go back to what you said.

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You can also buy PDF patterns on Simplicity.com and don't have to worry about, you know, going

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to the Store or whatever. I'm stumped on why.

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I think they, you know, with the introduction of the Know Me brand, where they take these independent

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designers, they have the collaboration with Mimi G.

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And her husband and, you know, they.

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They were doing great things.

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They had this whole section where they are promoting these independent pattern designers.

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And then all of a sudden it was like, well, we're done.

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I really don't think their base was Joanne, if I'm being honest.

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That one, I will say is probably more about the money, but that one left me a little bit stumped.

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I think it's the. Unfortunately for simplicity, it's like the perfect storm.

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Because here Joanne's closes and then the. The printer that.

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The person, the manufacturer that makes the printer that actually prints the tissue paper and

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prints the patterns, they also went out of business. So it's. They're losing. They're losing the.

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The person that can actually print the patterns.

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They're also losing Joanne's and they're in the middle.

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I just think it was unfortunately the perfect storm.

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Instead of them trying to take the time to pivot and to do more digital and PDFs, like, I really

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think they really should have invested it.

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I think I first read the article on Craft Industry Alliance.

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I think they kind of did all of the research on it and people just did their own research from there.

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The printer that does the tissue paper print is based in the US And I went to their website.

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They still have a website.

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So I don't know if they're out of business or not, but I know that a lot of independent designers

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got their patterns printed through this company.

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I'm assuming that they're still doing it. I'm not sure.

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And I know that was a big part of their business for tissue paper.

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So maybe they won't do that anymore.

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Maybe that part of the business is closing.

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But as far as I see, the business is still viable because they do other packaging and stuff like that.

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I think like seasoned sewers will be fine.

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And people that are just getting into it, I think it's going to give them the most disservice

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because it's like a central place for them to go to get patterns.

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So I think it's going to be the most detrimental to the new sewers, as far as I know. I saw like a.

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I think it was an IG post. Mimi G.

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Said something that they just told them that they were liquidating the patterns.

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They didn't close the companies.

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That's the same thing they told joann employees in the Beginning.

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So I think this is just the first step.

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I don't think we have all the information yet.

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I also think it's maybe a prime time for independent designers and pattern makers to begin to

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start making their clothing and then turning it into a PDF pattern, because, I mean, it's definitely

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possible, and then having all of the formats so that somebody can print it out.

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I mean, honestly, as an independent pattern designer, I'm looking at it as an opportunity because

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they were so big and had so much.

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If that is gone, people are still going to sell, but they're going to start looking elsewhere.

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So if you are an independent pattern designer or you want to get into it, I think now is the

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prime opportunity to do so, because if they are going away, there's going to be a void in the

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market, you know, so this is where you, you take advantage and try to, you know, promote yourself.

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And of course, that's what I'm going to try to do.

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You know what I'm saying?

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One thing that I would say about the Big Four, they had a certain size model in mind.

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That wasn't us, it wasn't me.

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I can speak for myself. It was not me.

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It's like every pattern that you got, you had to adjust accordingly.

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But I knew that, you know, because like, I've been sewing for years, so I knew what I had to adjust on each pattern.

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You had to, you know, make the torso shorter, you had to make the back longer.

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You know, just stuff that, you know, is going to, to work for your body.

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But I think that was the disconnect.

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I think I bought like one or two Nomi pattern, but it's still the same specs. It's not.

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They didn't change the fit of anything.

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I was just about to say that even with the know me patterns, I mean, Nomi patterns go up to what, 26, 30?

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So whatever size they go up to, but I still find myself having to adjust the bottom, adjust the hip, you know.

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You know, what a great market.

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I'm going to give, I'm going to give you a pitch right now.

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Make stuff for petite women, petite, curvy women.

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We need stuff for short girls with big assets.

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Before we, we started recording, I was working on stuff for my class and I was cutting out the

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trouser and I gotta take like four inches off the trouser, which means I gotta bring everything up.

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And then it's like, I.

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These are things I have to teach because my students are.

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They are not standard size because they're human beings. And they're real people. So untapped market.

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It's not necessarily tall women.

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It's just like the average because everybody's not five six, wasn't it? Or five eight.

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A regular six on there was really like a zero.

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It wasn't the average U.S. woman.

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I mean, the average U.S. woman is a size 12.

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You know, average size is five four, not five six, five eight.

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Why are you making, you know, it didn't really, it didn't match.

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So in my sizing that I do a sample size in a size 12, 14 and the, the height is 5 4.

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So if you, if you're taller than 5 4, you have to add and if you're shorter, you have to detract.

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But it's still the average.

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I mean, most people are within the 5, 4, 55 height range.

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They catered to a certain demographic.

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And I think Joann's had a lot to do with the, the liquidation because they had a lot of inventory.

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I also read they said something about the tariffs, which doesn't really make sense because the

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printing was done in the us So I was like that, that, that's like an excuse, you know, and that

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has something to, that has a lot to do with money, like Naima said.

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So it had to be some other factors in it that caused them to do the liquidation.

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When you think about it too, nobody is going on simplicity for trim.

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You know, it's, it's a rare thing.

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Nobody's going to buy their trims and, and notions and stuff like that's not the first thing you think of.

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So if the pattern making is your business and you're doing it well and you're the only company,

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because remember when we first started sewing, they were all individual companies.

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I have some vintage patterns and there was like one size per pattern.

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Like the things that they do now we didn't have.

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Simplicity was its own thing.

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And then I think McCall's and Butterick came together and Vogue was still its own thing.

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Now, not all of them mothers, but the same thing.

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If more independent designers and pattern makers come forward with more of the lines and more

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variety in fitting, it may actually help some of the, the individual, the new sewers, because

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they won't have to go through the headache of don't, don't look at, don't look at the six, look at the measurements.

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And it's like, no, no, no, this is going to fit you whatever size.

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Like this is going to also fit the curvy, this is going to fit the petite.

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But also it will, it will help to branch out so they can see other independent designers, but

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also pique their interest into getting into learning pattern making, because we all also teach

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that and digital pattern making.

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So it, it will actually, it may actually help them to be a little bit more creative and take control over their clothing.

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Take this as your opportunity.

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If you want to get into pattern making, start learning now.

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It's going to be a market for it if this comes to fruition and they actually liquidate and close.

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On that note, I am Zahia from COVID Me Chic, along with Naima from.

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Fearless Threads and Letitia of Keeping youg Stitches.

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Thanks for hanging out with us on the Designer's Plants and Coffee podcast.

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If you love this episode, please leave a review, share it with your creative friend, or tag us on Instagram.

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Until next time, keep dreaming big and growing slow.